Posted by Bryon Billado on September 05, 2003 at 16:46:46:
In Reply to: Re: Please don't dwell on blowing the subs posted by Bink on September 05, 2003 at 15:57:22:
Hi,
I don't think our SPL is very high compared to rock clubs in 80s....pretty low to my ears.....
Patron and bar owners get bothered when they have lean over and shout a drink order in someone's ears....so we try and are asked to keep it under a roar.
What I would love to acheive is a "high-fi" arena rock type low end (tight but not boomy) at coffeeshop volume. (not that we play at coffeeshop volume, but we do alot of weddings etc where that would be great).
My thought was that more subs (and better subs) would get closer to that ideal by physically pushing more air at you so you would feel it a little more pressure at the same volume.
My next pipedream would probably be a Driverack PA or some other "processor" crossover, but that adds a level of complexity for each gig (like you say) to tune it properly.I have a chance to try these subs and get them used and I thought that would be a good step.
A few of those names sound REALLY familiar and the pics look somewhat familiar, but none that I really know.
I was there from 81 till 85, lived on Westland Ave, worked at the AVIS parking garage...maybe they can relate....
Thanks for ALL your help and follow up,
Bryon
: Okay, Bryon, I'm over the blowing subs thing. 2-3 failures in 11 years isn't really an indicator. And I spaced the QSC amp model -- your 1.8 has no 50Hz HPF.
: From some things you say in your other posts, it seems like your SPL is already very high. At this point, I think getting resonance from people's chest cavity is going to be a timing thing. You've got the kick drum making a wave on stage and you've got the subs making two waves next to the stage -- basically you've got three dogs trying to shake your audience like the proverbial rat. If you can delay your speakers so that all three dogs hit the rat at the same time then the shaking will be one big shake, not two or three little quick ones that just end up wiggling the rat. You have to consider your top box power down at the chest response area of 80-90Hz, too; likely your tops can be seen as two more (weaker) dogs that have to be timed as well. Five dogs! You could either include the tops in the equation or move the crossover frequency up to ~160Hz and reduce their role. I say include them... So now I'm refining/trimming my advice to: Get a DSP crossover and use its limiting, delay and HPF functions. But you'll still need to know how to time the speakers to the kick drum mic at every gig.
: About the two hot subwoofers versus four subs at lower watts per sub: It looks like the LAB jury is nearly split on whether four is better. This is possibly because you're asking about a borderline area at the edge of high performance where small changes in methodology will yield different results for different people.
: You say Berklee in the early '80's? A few of my friends went there around that time. Did you know Jeff Cleland (bass), Andy Bacon (drums), Adam Lipansky (guitar), Eric Stewart (guitar - not the guy from 10CC), Jim Burnett (guitar) or Matt Elliott (piano/multi-instr., composer, stage lighting) ??
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: Dig the price tag...
: -Bink